Secession is, as usual, just talk

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Secession is, as usual, just talk

By Tracy Warner
Editorial Page Editor

Friday, December 7, 2012

You have to make the legal point at the outset: It is not possible for a state to secede from the union just by asking. You can file as many petitions as you like, but you can’t get out. When this or any state asked to join the union, and permission was granted, it became a permanent contract, unbreakable unilaterally. That was the understanding among many framers of the Constitution, according to scholars. If you were asleep in your junior high history class, you should be told that we fought a fairly significant war to settle the issue. There’s even a Supreme Court ruling, from 1868, that says the union of states is “indestructible.”

Maybe, if the other states want you out, that’s a different matter. But generally, those of you who dream of a new Republic of (insert state here) are fooling yourselves. Which makes the talk lately about secession just fun, or stupid. What should trouble us is there really are people who think their state’s separation is not only possible, but a really good idea. There have always been these people, on left and right, one side getting more attention depending on who won the last election and who is eating the sour grapes.

Since President Obama won the election (fair and square, I might add), the secession talk is loudest in states that liked him least. Texas is most prominent, as usual, with secession petitions drawing signatures in the tens of thousands, political action committees formed to collect money from supporters of ludicrous causes, and a large market for bumper stickers created. The White House has facilitated the tittering with its “We The People” website, where anybody can create a petition on anything to be signed by anybody. If your petition gets 25,000 signatures in 30 days it will receive an official response from the White House. Some petitions deal with serious issues, and many do not. Among the recent official responses is the release of the ingredients for the president’s home brew, White House Honey Ale. You have a First Amendment right to petition the government for redress of grievances and beer recipes.

The White House petition-for-anything site has secession requests from 50 states. There are two for Washington. One was originated by someone named Dannah P of East Wenatchee, with 4,593 signatures as of this morning. It quotes the opening paragraphs of the Declaration of Independence, as many petitions do. It is going nowhere.

We’ve dealt with secessionitis before. Prior to the election, when the polls showed a chance for a Republican victory, the talk came more from the left. Knute Berger at Crosscut speculated on the topic in October, wondering if a Mitt Romney victory might promote the separation of Cascadia, roughly defined as Washington, Oregon, parts of British Columbia and the cool looking, unpotatoed parts of Idaho. This “bioregion” could form an “ecotopia,” or so the thinking goes. Portland and Seattle eco-dreamers have been musing about it for some time. They even have a flag, green and blue with a tree, called “Old Doug,” which is not old but can be waved at soccer matches.

There are some acknowledged problems with Cascadia concept, notably that most of Cascadia probably doesn’t want anything to do with it, or that the United States owns a good share of the land and electric generating facilities, which it will be unlikely to contribute to the new bioregional government. Then there are economic concerns, as in kiss Boeing goodbye, etc. Cascadia could be powerless, penniless and pointless.

Practical considerations never stopped the secessionists. Our own Sen. Bob Morton enjoyed filing legislation seeking to separate Eastern Washington from west, or form a new state from eastern Washington and Oregon and northern Idaho. It would been one of the poorest states in the union, but secession is sure fun to talk about.

Tracy Warner’s column appears Thursdays and Fridays. He can be reached at warner@wenatcheeworld.com or 665-1163.

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grbadave 5 months, 2 weeks ago

This editorial would've been more effective and honest if it pointed out that leftist talk of succession is the purview of those almost nobody has ever heard of, whereas on the right people who are considered leaders, and even get elected, promote this nonsense. A brave essay would've done a quick google and come up with a list of names that any well informed citizen would recognize. But that would undermine the false equivalency image you have described, and helped inform everyone that much of what passes for mainstream political conservativism these days is irresponsible yet still acceptable in a way that few significant liberals are willing to tolerate, even among their own cheerleaders.

kyook 5 months, 2 weeks ago

"This editorial would've been more effective and honest if it pointed out that leftist talk of succession is the purview of those almost nobody has ever heard of, whereas on the right people who are considered leaders, and even get elected, promote this nonsense."

Source?

grbadave 5 months, 2 weeks ago

The source is reality and common sense. Name me one Dem, or just simply a liberal anybody's ever actually heard of, who talked ominously about secession. Feel free to go back a couple of decades if you need to to find one. Then take 10 seconds, google the words secession, tea party, and republican, and find a ludicrous number of contemporary examples. That's the honesty that was missing from this editorial and much of our political discussions today in America. The nuts on the left are mostly ignored or dismuissed, except maybe by the Village Voice. In contrast many nuts on the right are actually paid attention to and in some cases have achieved status as leaders, elected or otherwise.

kyook 5 months, 2 weeks ago

"The source is reality and common sense."

So, you have nothing, eh?

Yeah, we get it...your second post is pretty much a re-run of the first, unsubstantiated "facts" peppered with biased opinion and assumptions.

milo 5 months, 2 weeks ago

You can't name even one well-known Dem or progressive talking about secession even if you go back decades so you ask for proof? You can't prove a negative. You are simply being rude and abusive as usual.

grbadave 5 months, 2 weeks ago

Milo, Kyook, I can't prove there are no black helicopters either. Please read dickander. He did a better job than I did in my first post. Maybe this will start making sense for you now.

kyook 5 months, 2 weeks ago

There's a big difference between "You can't name even one well-known Dem or progressive talking about secession even if you go back decades" as in not even a single one exists (proving a negative) and gbrdaves, "You can't name even one well-known Dem or progressive talking about secession even if you go back decades" as in they exist but nobody has ever heard of them. I can guarantee that somebody from their districts have heard of them.

I didn't make the claim above nor did I claim that "In contrast many nuts on the right are actually paid attention to and in some cases have achieved status as leaders, elected or otherwise" so it really isn't incumbent upon me to prove anything, negative or otherwise, it's on gbrdave, and when pressed to do so he can't do it. He can only support his contentions with drivel like, "The source is reality and common sense."

Are we supposed to believe his "facts" just because he says they are true? I don't think so.

Sorry if you think that's rude and abusive.Maybe you are satisfied with such a low level of credibility but I'm not.

grbadave 5 months, 2 weeks ago

I don't think it's rude or abusive at all. Just nonsense, but you're far from alone. Sorry about Rick Perry. I'm sure he would've made a great GOP Prez. Maybe now he can fulfill your collective dreams in the great nation of Texas. Which, according to some, is still technically an independent state, and that makes it true. So remember thte Alamo, and be sure not to forget to make the same mistake twice.

kyook 5 months, 2 weeks ago

I'm not sorry about Rick Perry, he's a bigger buffoon than Joe Biden, if that's humanly possible.

I remember the Alamo story, but I'm afaid it's too late a mistake has already been made for the second time, but don't blame me.

bushman66 5 months, 2 weeks ago

Don't worry, grbadave, kyook's the same dude who told me a yr or so ago that gasoline prices were a)Obama's fault or, b)supply/demand. The guy's a genius - & know's way more than us. You gotta trust him on that knowin' everything, 'cuz he can't/won't give you any references. All the best.

kyook 5 months, 1 week ago

a) Obama's fault (disallowing Keystone pipeline, disallowing exploration/drilling/permits, green agenda, etc) b) supply and demand c) speculators d) oil company manipulation e) unrest in the middle east

Yes, all of the above.

bushman66 5 months, 1 week ago

O.K., kyook, but, you might be interested in the senate's finding out whether refineries in CA were still refining when they said they were shut down, thus, artifically driving up gasoline prices. The refinery shut-down was cited by the oil companies for the gasoline price spike. The US is producing more crude under this administration than ever before - we're actually exporting more than we import. Keystone pipeline would route foreign oil (Canadian) to refineries in TX for export. Supply/demand has nothing to do w/the price of gasoline. Oil company manipulation is what I always maintained was happening (i.e., the refineries' "shutdown"). Ever seen "non-unrest" in the middle east in your lifetime?

kyook 5 months, 1 week ago

"Supply/demand has nothing to do w/the price of gasoline."

That's odd because supply and demand seem to affect nearly every other consumable on the planet, perhaps you could explain why gasoline would be the single exception to, dare I say, an almost universal rule.

bushman66 5 months, 1 week ago

Actually, kyook, I can't explain why gasoline prices are not subject to supply/demand. Most other folks can't either, hence, the senate inquiry. But, let's find out.

Don 5 months, 2 weeks ago

Bashar al-Assad could stop all the violence in Syria if he just reminded everyone it is illegal to stand up to the government.

dickanders 5 months, 2 weeks ago

Interesting...you only have to look at the upper right hand column on this web page to see a couple of articles that include state politicians, including state representatives, state senators, a governor or two, a former leader of the Republican-controlled House of Representatives and other luminaries of the Republican party who are advocating nullification of federal laws or secession. All those people claim to love the Constitution and like to refer to themselves and others who agree with them as "Patriots".

It reminds me of people who like to display the Stars and Bars of the old Confederate flag which is actually the flag of traitors to the United States of America and the Constitution that makes us free and a nation of laws that protect us and requires our fidelity. As a former Marine the motto Semper Fidelis -- Always Faithful, Always Loyal -- has real meaning. Those who would rend our nation apart over their ideology rather than seek compromise to further the national good are not patriots. They are following the path of those traitors who sought to dissolve the Union to protect the right for one person to own other persons, and to force others to bend the knee to that shameful practice.

lonedog3 5 months, 2 weeks ago

"As a former Marine the motto Semper Fidelis -- Always Faithful, Always Loyal" Faithfull and loyal to what? a group of people that have no interest in the people that elected them? A group of people that are and will destroy this great nation we once served, willing to protect with our lives? Of the top ten richest congressmen 8 of them are democrats. What does that tell you who these deceitful people serve?

bushman66 5 months, 2 weeks ago

Oh brother.

dickanders 5 months, 2 weeks ago

As a member of the military I swore an oath to defend and protect the constitution -- not some unnamed group of people. As for elected officials, we regularly have the right and privilege to vote them out of office, or vote others into office. In fact, that is what elections are for. And my loyalty does not depend on who gets elected because our nation is bigger than that. When I pledge allegiance it is not to a person but to our nation. We survived the most destructive and corrupt administration who got us into two wars,destroyed our economy, and ran up a huge deficit. But no one talked about seceding from the Union then. Now, with the attempt to get our economy back on its feet, and take care of other important needs, it is silly to talk about leaving.