Link socked with unexpected tech expenses

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Link socked with unexpected tech expenses

Tuesday, March 5, 2013

WENATCHEE — Technology’s been costing Link Transit a lot of money lately. At least, a lot more than it expected to pay this soon.

The public-transportation agency has paid about $350,000 to replace both its on-board communications system and scheduling software, after one vendor discontinued service and another shut down, Richard DeRock, Link general manager, said Friday.

“We were counting on the old technology lasting five more years,” DeRock said. “This isn’t a major crisis, but it was badly timed.”

The switch in both systems kept nine new paratransit vehicles mothballed for about five months, DeRock said, because they needed the scheduling software, which could not be put to use until the cellular-based, on-board communications system was in place.

A bigger challenge for Link is keeping its diesel buses running after installing emissions-control equipment required to meet new federal standards, he said.

Engine conflicts with the emissions-control computers have had the three newer diesel buses in the shop for most of the last 2.5 years, he said. The equipment greatly reduces engine life, and replacement engines aren’t readily available.

The vehicles cost $150,000 each, paid for with a federal grant. They’re under warranty, but Link mechanics must do the repair work first before the agency can request cost reimbursements, he said.

The grant requires the buses remain in service for 10 years, he said.

“The emissions standards have challenged the manufacturers,” he said. “We’re not the only people having this problem. It’s across the industry.”

To get around the problem, Link has been buying used buses that aren’t subject to the more stringent emissions requirements and rebuilding their engines.

The older buses aren’t as clean burning, but are more dependable, he said.

Link has stopped buying diesel-powered smaller vehicles in favor of gasoline powered, because emissions-control add-ons for the diesels have driven up the price, he said.

The agency is in the process of converting around 14 of these gasoline-powered vans to propane, which is slightly cleaner burning than gasoline and costs about 85-cents per gallon at contract prices compared to $3.20 per gallon for gas.

The conversion should cost about $120,000 for the first 14 vehicles, he said.

“Technology has its two edges. It does make things better, with better emissions, but it also has its costs,” he said.

Christine Pratt: 665-1173

pratt@wenatcheeworld.com

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lonedog3 2 months, 2 weeks ago

how about we just replace all the managers at link and start fresh with people that have a clue about running a public transportation service not at the taxpayers expense? This has gone beyond absurd! There is not enough service in this valley to even come close to warranting this kind of continuous cost.

FootballNut 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Or better yet, get rid of link entirely. What a waste of taxpayer dollars!! There's a reason the windows on all of those buses are shaded. They don't want anyone to see how empty they are!

galvamega 2 months, 2 weeks ago

I rely on link transit to go from rock island to college. and from college to work. and from work to home. i would be out of college, and unemployed if i had no transportation. Plus everyone else who rides link wouldnt be able to go about their daily working lives. Tons of running start students use the bus service to get to college and back to their high school. not to mention those who cannot afford a vehicle need the transportation as well.

Dave 2 months, 2 weeks ago

If they need it so bad, why don't they pay for it?

ericwest 2 months, 2 weeks ago

How is carrying over 3000 people each day empty. Why don't you take a look at the passenger activity at Wenatchee Valley College, or in the morning or evening as commuter buses are coming from or going back to Chelan or Leavenworth.

lonedog3 2 months, 1 week ago

you do not carry 3000 people and you, along with your numbers have said so. I person, with transfers and a round trip can and does account for 6 plus riders.

lonedog3 2 months, 2 weeks ago

"Tons of running start students" OK, I give up. How many people comprise a ton let alone tons? I see the busses and my guess it is that there are not that many people in a ton.

galvamega 2 months, 2 weeks ago

If you see the number of students riding the link bus you would see that link is a valuable resource to the community. When i arrive to the bus station after class the 21 (Entiat & Chelan) bus has a lot of people waiting to get on. The route 5 inbound has a lot of riders. The 23 has a lot of riders. People who CANNOT afford a vehicle or gas use the link bus by either paying full fare, or by buying a pass. this income is what helps keep link running.

nohands76 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Nice to have all the answers for the valley's problems! Ton's of us wish you would give up.

iansfolks 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Link says that in February there were 9378 passenger boardings on weekdays for the route 5 that serves the College. Divide that by the 19 weekdays that it operated and then divide that by the 25 trips per day and you get 19.7 passengers on every trip. If each person weighs 105 pounds, guess what!!!!! You get a ton of passengers on every trip on route five!!!!

lonedog3 2 months, 2 weeks ago

that is only if someone actually believes the numbers from link. Any group solely dependent on tax money will always inflate the numbers to appear like the tax dollars are going to a good cause. What I see here is a bunch of kids that pay no taxes, own no property which is taxed so heavily to support the freeloaders whining about their free rides in life. If link is such a big benefit to the kids riding it then link should come up with a fair yet equal ticket price to offset the cost so the burden is lifted from the hard working tax paying property owners that have worked hard to get where they are today. So 9378 student riders at say $3 a day is what $28,134.00 a month? That is probably not enough so the tickets should probably be at least $4 a day. Now the students are paying their fair share and the tax payers are not subsidizing them. Life is not about what you can get for free but rather what you earn.

JimboBear 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Just my two cents worth here, but I do believe that any metropolitan area needs a functional public transportation system. I have had occasion to use such service before my eye surgery when I couldn't see well enough to drive or even ride a bicycle. The availability of public transport was a life saver for me then even though it was painfully slow and awkward to travel the 50 miles door to door for my medical appointments. A transit system is one of the reasons that people congregate in any "metropolitan" area or city. The question becomes whether or not Wenatchee and it's surrounding area qualifies as a "metropolis" or "metropolitan area" and has the customer base to make public transportation feasible..

That said, I personally don't believe that the city of Wenatchee is large enough to justify trips to the outlying communities. No wonder their fuel costs are so high, if you consider the highway miles driven in order to provide transport to Wenatchee and back for so few people. I would think that the service also is detrimental to the outlying communities because it provides a means for those who live in those areas to go to Wenatchee to spend their money. Sure! That's good for Wenatchee businessmen, but what does it do for the local merchants in the outlying areas? Of course, one can also find better prices in Seattle and Spokane, so what's next? Does Link plan on establishing routes to those cities as well sometime in the near future?

My thoughts would be for Link to give up some of their lofty goals and delusions of grandeur. Serve the people in the Wenatchee and East Wenatchee city limits and serve them better than they currently do. Leave the trips to outlying areas (yes, even Rock Island) to some sort of stage line (which would be yet another business opportunity for someone) and leave all the high tech vehicles to much larger cities that are more able to afford them for now. In the future, when the electrics and other alternate energy systems have been proven as reliable and efficient, have another look and see if they would be worthwhile locally. To do otherwise seems to be placing an obligation to subsidize outlying commuters on the shoulders of those who live in the city.

ericwest 2 months, 2 weeks ago

JimboBear, Link was put into place to serve all the communities in the taxing district. To withdraw service from these places would require a public vote.

JimboBear 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Yes, I understand that Eric, but let me ask this. How many "daily" Leavenworth riders do you have? Now, don't add all the communities between Wenatchee and Leavenworth, just Leavenworth. How many to Chelan, or any of the other outlying communities? My point being that with the limited ridership to any of those areas, perhaps the "commuter" fares should be increased. The cost to commute certainly would have increased recently due to increased costs of all aspects if they were using their own vehicles.

"To withdraw service from these places would require a public vote." Well, perhaps that is in order.

ericwest 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Link was established in 1990 by a vote from citizens in Chelan County and part of Douglas County. True, it did not pass in Douglas County bit it passed by enough in Chelan County to make that up. So all communities in the taxing district deserve transit service. This vote authorized a .4% increase in sales tax to go to help fund Link. This equates to 40¢ on a $100 purchase, and "equals" about $69 per resident per year. That is before you take into account those purchases that are made by tourists, etc.

Yes, some of our most expensive trips are those to Chelan and Leavenworth but if you would take the time to go ask the riders of those routes how valuable this service is to them, I am sure you would learn alot. Sure there are always people out there who are against any sort of government expenses that don't directly benefit them. If this mentality were to permeate all aspects of government spending, we would not have parks, libraries, schools, public safety, or many other services that improve the lives of all our citizens.

As far as the comment about students not paying taxes or owning property, I ask that you look at the long term social consequences of these people not having access to an education or an entry level job. Do you you want them on the public dole for the rest of their lives?

Why don't some of you with negative comments about something you know very little about attend one of Link's Board meetings, talk to one of our Board members, or better yet, talk to some of the people who ride Link and truly understand the value that public transportation provides them. I know asking you to come out of your cave is maybe a stretch, but you might also notice we have electricity and running water in Wenatchee now.

H 2 months, 2 weeks ago

When Link was established by a vote wasn't it passed with the knowledge that there would be no fares charged or was that only a temporary thing? I just don't remember.

ericwest 2 months, 2 weeks ago

It was with the understanding that it would be fare-free. The loss of 45% of our funding through the elimination of the motor vehicle excise tax in 1999 (I-695) forced us to cut about half of our service, and implement fares. Since that time, we have been able to return to service levels that are very close to what they were prior to I-695, without any additional local taxes. Fares have gone up 3 times in this period as well.

kyook 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Eric, what % of the overall cost to operate do fares cover? I would speculate that it is a very small percentage.

FootballNut 2 months, 2 weeks ago

7.6% based on the 2011 audit.

kyook 2 months, 2 weeks ago

So, out of the remaining 92.4%, how much comes directly from taxes paid by people who don't ride the bus...ever?

FootballNut 2 months, 2 weeks ago

It'd be pure speculation, but I'd say close to 90%.

ericwest 2 months, 1 week ago

About 92% of our funding is from some sort of tax, either the local sales tax or money that comes from the state or Federal government. But some of this comes from people who ride the bus very often.

ericwest 2 months, 1 week ago

I apologize for my final comment here. It was unprofessional of me, and not in keeping with how I want to represent our agency. It was not meant to be offensive, yet only to illustrate how there are so many great things in our community that we all benefit from in some way or another. Admittedly, my tax dollars go towards projects that I will never or rarely use, but that doesn't mean they should be shut down, torn out, mothballed, etc.

Public transit is a very complicated business, and we must comply with a myriad of state and federal rules, undergo strict scrutiny on our performance, and deal with a myriad of requests for service changes and improvements.

We are here to serve you, and appreciate your opinions and comments. Please keep an open mind and look at things from a broader perspective.

Again, my apologies.

lonedog3 2 months, 1 week ago

"Admittedly, my tax dollars go towards projects that I will never or rarely use" But link has shown over and over that tax money is being wasted on insane ideas of the grandiose nature. Big electric busses that do not work? Hugh busses that move empty when smaller ones could do the job? Trollies complete with idiotic bells? Show some healthy cuts in spending and the people may have a tendency to back the busses a bit more.

lonedog3 2 months, 2 weeks ago

I say we call for a vote! start using our tax money more wisely. With the ridership as low as it is there is no need what so ever for huge busses or those trolleys. Link could save tens of thousands by reducing the size of the buses

" As far as the comment about students not paying taxes or owning property, I ask that you look at the long term social consequences of these people not having access to an education or an entry level job. Do you want them on the public dole for the rest of their lives? ." Way too many people have made it through schooling without whining and crying that they are owed some service. This statement will not fly.

Sort of bitter in the rest of your comments mr west. Perhaps this is another reason link needs a few changes on top.

ericwest 2 months, 2 weeks ago

In reference to the size of our buses, we don't have a whole lot of options when it comes to vehicle sizes. The Federal government requires us to "Buy American", which severely limits our choices. Going to a smaller bus is not really an option in many cases.

I don't think anybody thinks they are "owed" anything, but rather are taking advantage of a public service that will help them better their lives. Perhaps their economic situation will not allow them to move to Wenatchee or another community to further their education.

Dudleydoright 2 months, 2 weeks ago

I was against the bus service from the beginning but it would be good to know what the actual cost of ridership is and not the cost of every ride, but the cost including transfers. So if "Joe" rides the bus and makes three transfers that counts as one ride. My guess is the cost is high enough to buy each rider a car.

ericwest 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Each time someone boards a bus, that counts as a "trip". So if someone takes 3 buses to get to their destination, yes they are counted three times. This is the industry standard. In 2012, we had 861,906 boardings on our fixed route buses, down about 11% from 2011. Please feel free to contact us if you would like more specific information regarding our budget and ridership.

lonedog3 2 months, 2 weeks ago

so the more transfers some poor soul has to make the better your numbers look. I get it now. where's my free phone?

FootballNut 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Just doing some quick math here, and feel free to correct me if I’m wrong. Looking at the figures in the 2011 audit for Link, they took in $792,114 in fares, $7,376,441 in Sales tax, $242,418 in State Grant Revenue, $2,500 in Other Grant – Washington State Insurance Pool, $1,860,119 in Federal Grant Revenue, $8,037 in Interest Income and $106,323 in other operating revenues. Subtracting out the fares and interest income, I come up with a figure of $9,587,801 that comes from the taxpayer in one way, shape or form on an annual basis.

According to Link’s website, they carry an average of about 3,610 a day. That amounts to $7.28 per rider per day (9,587,801/365/3,610). Add that to the existing fare and charge accordingly and Link is off the taxpayer’s back.

I’m not against public mass transit, but the problem is that the only masses we have around here are at the Catholic Churches. It’s too much overhead for too few riders. If it wasn’t on the public dole, it sounds like all the Federal strings that are attached would go away and you could then obtain the vehicles you truly do need to serve the actual needs of the ridership and it would be even more cost effective. Just sayin’

JimboBear 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Just keep in mind that Mr. West's position as Marketing Director doesn't allow him to tell you there are any faults in the system. He gets paid to make people think it's a great deal no matter how it's paid for.

kyook 2 months, 2 weeks ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

lonedog3 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Keep in mind also that of that 3610 riders a day many are the same person(s) just making a lot of transfers. So if one allows for all the transfers (one of the biggest gripes I hear about link) Your daily rider numbers drop by more than half. So in reality your probably looking at a number of riders a day at 1203 or less. So If one student rode the bus twice, once to school and once back to his parents over taxed home with 2 transfers each trip that student just accounted for 6 riders the way link calculates their daily riders. Nice way to con more tax dollars!

Norm 2 months, 2 weeks ago

"Keep in mind also that of that 3610 riders a day many are the same person(s) just making a lot of transfers."

You nearly made a valid point there, but then fell into the same trap that Link's statistics did: focusing on number of passengers per day. A more relevant unit for measuring the benefit provided by link is not the number of passengers per day (regardless of transfer issues), it is passenger-miles.

According to the Link site, estimated total mileage for Link transit service is in excess of 2.2 million miles and the 2011 operating budget was $10.4 million. Presumably, that operating budget includes all costs associated with maintaining all aspects of the service - fuel, maintenance, wages and benefits, insurance, administrative costs, etc.. With those numbers, the cost per mile traveled is $4.73.

Now to actually measure the value gained for that $4.73 per mile expense, one must know how many passengers there are per mile. If there is a system-wide average of ten riders per mile, then the cost is $.473 per passenger-mile; if there is an average of 20 riders, then the average cost is $.236 per passenger-mile.

Once the cost is known, it can be compared to the benefits. One obvious benefit of public transit is a reduction of congestion, which results in cost savings by reducing the need to expand road capacity (like the recent modification of the bridge). And it reduces maintenance costs on existing roadways as well as eliminating maintenance costs on roads that don't need to be built. Another source of savings is that to the extent that fuel use per passenger-mile is decreased (compared to other forms of transportation, like one person per car), there is a savings on fuel subsidies and a reduction in pollution created per passenger mile.

The above savings are based on the assumption that each passenger would travel the same amount of miles by some other means if public transportation weren't available. What about passengers who travel more miles with public transportation than they would otherwise? Are they just freeloaders who spend their time riding buses back and forth just to laugh about how they're riding on other peoples' dime? Probably not. Chances are, they're traveling to increase their participation in the economy - by traveling to buy more goods and services from local merchants, by traveling to work to earn money to spend, or by traveling to educate themselves to increase their potential economic contribution when they graduate and enter the workforce. This travel to increase economic activity benefits far more persons than just those who personally use public transportation.

These are just a few of the benefits of public transportation to be weighed against its costs.

lonedog3 2 months, 2 weeks ago

but again we are all guessing at numbers since the truth will never be known. How many buses ran to Chelan or Leavenworth at 70 miles per hour with few riders? how many make the trip around town, again, with no riders? All is pure guess work no matter which equation we use since the taxpayers will never know the true numbers.

ericwest 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Our numbers are all open for your review and questions. We undergo a state audit every year or two, and an audit by the Federal Transit Administration every 3 years. Please feel free to come out and talk with us in person about our statistics. You will be amazed at the things we have to keep track of and report.

Norm 2 months, 2 weeks ago

How about passenger miles per year? I've been looking up various reports and audits and have yet to find Link's annual passenger miles. If its not measured, why not? Isn't that a more accurate way to measure use than number of riders per day?

ericwest 2 months, 1 week ago

Norm, I think that is one of the numbers we have to report to the FTA. You can call us at 664-7600 and ask to speak to someone about these numbers.

kyook 2 months, 1 week ago

Eric, since the question was asked directly to you here in the discussion forum, why don't you answer it here?

It almost seems like you are avoiding the questions that you are being asked in favor of telling the questioners to "come out and talk with us in person" and "call us at 664-7600 and ask to speak to someone". Maybe you could address the concerns of many other posters/readers by commenting here instead of making several people contact Link directly. Call it marketing.

lonedog3 2 months, 1 week ago

"Our numbers" This statement sums this discussion up in a nutshell!!

Dudleydoright 2 months, 2 weeks ago

Sound like about $300 per rider per month, that's a cheap car with insurance and fuel but doable if that is all you have. I don care to fund tree huggers transportation, kids can walk or ride like I did ( or beg a ride) and old folks had the senior bus, why did we vote for this again?

FootballNut 2 months, 2 weeks ago

I didn't

ericwest 2 months, 1 week ago

It's an awfully long walk from Chelan or Leavenworth to Wenatchee Valley College. And we are mandated by the Feds to provide ADA service to disabled individuals and seniors so this takes up a good percentage of our budget, to the tune of $2 million or more per year.

JimboBear 2 months, 1 week ago

You are mandated to make multiple runs to Leavenworth each day with a full sized transit buss to satisfy ADA requirements? Mr. West, do you realize how far fetched that sounds? Could you quote chapter and verse of the ADA please? It's not that I don't believe you, it's just that since you are paid with public monies I'd like to keep you on your toes. Thank you Sir. I might also add that the students get a special and hugely discounted rate of fare. Is that not true? I wouldn't hang my hat on people who don't pay full fare, even though I as a partially disabled senior als get a huge discount should I choose to avail myself of your service. The point is Mr. West, what is the percentage of full fare riders vs those who ride at a discount? I'm guessing, but I suspect that the ratio vastly favors the discounts. Do you really expect those people who pay the full rate to pay for the majority of your service? My! Isn't that rather presumptive?

ericwest 2 months, 1 week ago

JimboBear: We don not provide any direct ADA service trips between Wenatchee and Leavenworth. IF there is an ADA-eligible individual who needs to make this trip, they are picked up by our general public dial-a ride service in Leavenworth, transferred onto a fixed route (big bus) to Wenatchee, and then transferred onto our LinkPlus service to reach their final destination. This is a much less expensive way to provide the service than sending a special bus to pick this person up in Leavenworth and bring them into Wenatchee, and then take them home again. A trip like that would be about $100 in cost, where as the way we provide it costs us probably 25 to 35% of that.

As far as student discounts, all students who pay cash need to pay the full fare, same as an able bodied adult. If they have bought their annual pass for $120, then they pay no fare. We have a arrangement with Wenatchee Valley College where each student pays $3.20 per quarter for transit, and then they can ride for no fare. They all pay, even if they don't use it. We have about 400 boardings per day from college students coming not just from the outlying areas but also from those who live within Wenatchee and East Wenatchee. How do we know this? Because when college is not in session, our boardings go down by about that many per day. Yes, an assumption, but we think a pretty fair one.

As far as discounted fares versus full fares, can I assume that by discounts, you are referring to anything but a cash payment of the highest possible fare? Our fare collection systems are pretty simple so we don't have any way to know how many times a single individual uses their monthly pass. Pass boardings account for about 51% of our total boardings But our records indicate that for those people paying cash when they board, about 3% are getting a discount. ADA eligible individuals can ride the fixed route buses for no cost. This is cheaper than having them use our paratransit service at a cost to Link of $25 - $30 per trip. They account for about 4% of our fixed route boardings.Hope this answers your questions.

JimboBear 2 months, 1 week ago

That answers a great deal Eric. Thank you for the input. Your system appears to be very similar to the ones in most major cities. I would think that any regular riders would go for the least expensive method of paying their fares, so your explanation of student and senior reduced fare and the commuter pass didn't surprise me much. To be honest, although curious about percentage of reduced fare riders, I was just yanking your chain a bit. Thanks for the responses.

By the way, will Link honor my Regional Seniors pass from over on the west side? That could come in handy for me sometime if you do.

ericwest 2 months, 1 week ago

Not sure what that pass refers to. A bit out of my realm there. You can call our Guest Services folks at 662-1155 and ask them.

JimboBear 2 months, 1 week ago

Bad word choice on my part. It says on it "Regional Reduced Fare Permit (Senior). Has a magnetic strip on it which I believe is used by the Washington State Ferry system. I'll check with Guest services though, thanks!

lonedog3 2 months, 2 weeks ago

so there is no smaller van or bus "made in America"? Most routes could, seeing the amount of passengers on them, be serviced by a ford van. That wont work, made in Canada. How about a Chevy van? Oppps, made in Mexico. Dodge? Point is those great big electrical monstrosity's that have been eating out tax money should not have been bought as the cash numbers fail miserably at proving the justification for the waste other than a few over inflated egos at link.!

lonedog3 2 months, 1 week ago

$2 million a year or more just moving around disabled persons?? REALLY? I mean like REALLY?? Mandated, as Jimbo says, to run multiple runs to far off places with almost empty busses?? Come on While it is true I was born at night it darned sure wasn't last night.

ericwest 2 months, 1 week ago

Yes, it is a lot of money. But the Americans With Disabilities Act requires us to provide paratransit service to anyone who meets the Federal criteria. We must provide this service within 3/4 mile of our fixed routes. These trips have to be provided regardless of destination. So yes, this means that someone can take LinkPlus to the bingo hall or visit their friend. And we cannot charge more than twice the fixed route fare for these trips. We provide in the range of 250 -300 LinkPlus trips each weekday, and average about 3.5 to trips per hour of service. This is pretty good considering the national average is around 2.

And if you read my answer to JimboBears comment, you will see we don't provide any direct ADA trips between outlying communities and Wenatchee.

lonedog3 2 months, 1 week ago

went to town today saw a bus trying to make a turn but was too long to make the turn so everyone had to move. The buss only had 6 people on it. How much sense does this make to you??

rwcooper1954 2 months, 1 week ago

ericwest

"I know asking you to come out of your cave is maybe a stretch, but you might also notice we have electricity and running water in Wenatchee now."

Apparently, you work for Link. What part of your education formed your opinion that this would be a good way to address members of the public that essentially pay your salary?

lonedog3 2 months, 1 week ago

that is the normal response from people that cannot justify the bogus info being put out. eventually your numbers get all twisted up in a knot and you have to strike out in a negative mode to save yourself.

ericwest 2 months, 1 week ago

Mr Cooper:

We are here to serve you, and appreciate your opinions and comments. Please keep an open mind and look at things from a broader perspective.

Again, my apologies.

Belldandy 2 months, 1 week ago

I have been riding Link off and on for 10 years. I don't know what I would do without it. Sure, sometimes, I don't feel like standing around waiting for a bus, but considering how much maintenance, insurance and gas on a private vehicle is these days, it's worth it. Sure, the Link has been hit with expenses it wasn't counting on, and the Current I'm not exactly thrilled with. (If you've ridden it, you'd know why.) Regardless, I'm glad the valley has some sort of public transportation. I just wish it ran on Sundays like Grant Transit Authority does.