If you had a chance to sell your gun in a buy-back program, what would you do?

its_all_lies 4 months, 1 week ago

Will they pay me what its worth?

JimboBear 4 months, 1 week ago

"Will they pay me what its worth?"

Unless you own a piece of junk that isn't safe to use, they won't even come close. Maybe ten or fifteen cents on the dollar. You ready to give up your possessions for that kind of money?

its_all_lies 4 months, 1 week ago

You and I both know they'll offer some token, pidly amount. Only a fool would take them up on an offer like that.

carol 4 months, 1 week ago

No, but they will put your picture in the paper so the criminals will know who they can safely rob now !!

lonedog3 4 months, 1 week ago

you will get a certificate for a small chunk of government cheese redeemable at your local government run food market.

Chuck 4 months, 1 week ago

I, for one, would NEVER state in any public poll whether or not I'd even consider owning a firearm.

This website has no set "privacy policy" per se. Last time I tried to click on it, I was redirected back to the top of their terms of service.

And, like our library system, there is NOTHING in writing here stating that staff would ever demand even so little as a "national security letter" - let alone an actual warrant- before turning over your personal information to authorities.

In fact, I never read anything stating that the Wenatchee World wouldn't turn your information over to whomever they choose for reasons of their choosing.

But, if I'm wrong, I'm sure they'll let me know. :)

But again: on hot button issues like this: it's never in your best self interest to dignify questions like this with an answer regardless.

JimboBear 4 months, 1 week ago

" This website has no set "privacy policy" per se. "

I fail to understand why you take issue with this Chuck. If you don't see a "Privacy Policy Statement" then shouldn't it reasonably follow that there is none? It's like anything else on the Internet. If you don't wish to own it, don't post it. If you do, it may return to haunt you at any time. I have read the "Terms of Use" statement here many times, and I see it as just what was intended by the staff and no doubt their attorneys. It's a very broad and all encompassing statement that pretty much says we have covered our backsides here, but if you use the site you'll have to cover your own.

Aside from that, I like your thinking on the link between mental health issues and mass shootings. If we as a society spent the dollars we are spending on proposed gun legislation and protecting ourselves from such legislation on research and treatment of mental health issues rather than dumbing folks down with pharmaceuticals, I think our dollars would be far better spent. No matter how long we tell ourselves that one weapon is acceptable while another is not, the fact remains that we must regulate, treat or remove the crazed murderer, not his weapon(s) of choice. The number of deaths in each instance means nothing. One single life is just as precious as any other number of lives, but we MUST do something to remove the poison that has conditioned these perpetrators to have so little if any regard for human life and suffering.

Chuck 4 months, 1 week ago

Jimbo, I wasn't "taking issue" per se (although an actual privacy policy and an official assurance or two here would be nice), merely urging caution. It is fair to say that we live in an age of unbridled surveillance and there is no way around that for the foreseeable future. Therefore, when invited to comment on any generic question which may involve a personal admission of (in this case) gun ownership, the most prudent course is to avoid it like the plague and to urge your fellow countrymen/women to follow suit.

And thank you for your kind words regarding the obvious link I'd mentioned. With only 3,000 characters available for comment, I could not begin to list the incidents published in the infowars article I linked. BTW, the man who posted that link on his FaceBook page died a couple of days later in a particularly hinky car accident, not long before one of his peers was shot.

I didn't used to put much truck in conspiracy. Still, for the most part, I don't.

But when one takes a step back from certain things and starts looking at all the little stories flying by on the back pages and under the radar, the word "coincidence" vaporizes from the vernacular.

And let's face it: millions of Americans are questioning the link between SSRI class prescription drugs and unspeakable incidents of murder and/or suicide. We didn't have these drugs 50 years ago- nor did we have this class of crime.

I'm not mocking this city with the "Dr. Prozac" references either. Merely using that scandal as a foil. Honestly, how could any small town survive a beating in the national press like we got over Jim Goodwin and not be among the first in the nation to publicly question the drug/killing spree link?

http://www.infowars.com/prominent-rifle-manufacturer-killed-in-mysterious-car-crash-days-after-posting-psych-drug-link-to-school-shooters/

Like a lot of other things in the public discourse these days, it's simply hard for this man to get his mind around.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/199501/prozacville-usa

its_all_lies 4 months, 1 week ago

What are you afraid of, Chuck? Who cares if everyone on the planet knows you own guns? Dear Planet Earth, I OWN GUNS! I posess the ability to protect myself and my family almost everywhere in this state (and several others). Am I carrying today? Hmm....well, a woman does need her secrets......

Chuck 4 months, 1 week ago

Thanks for the smile! and I do believe a gentleman is entitled to his secrets as well. An element of surprise being a good thing in potentially defensive situations. LOL

But how do you feel about various newspapers across this country publishing the names and addresses of concealed carry permit holders? Is it fair that such information, if made public, leads to law-abiding gun owners being treated no better than child molesters?

ranchers 4 months, 1 week ago

StrongIf you trust the government to pay you what you believe your gun might be worth, go ahead and sell---don't blame me if your gun ends up on the Mexican border where Eric Holder's other guns ended up and you end of getting blamed because the gun was originally registered to you.

wonderstar 4 months, 1 week ago

I would participate if they offered Cabelas' gift cards instead of the cards offered in seattle.

Dave 4 months, 1 week ago

All of my guns were stolen!

Chuck 4 months, 1 week ago

Dave, I get the feeling that literally millions of otherwise law-abiding American citizens could very well start filing stolen gun reports in the near future.

And who among us would expect differently?

kenjo 4 months, 1 week ago

If I had the cash I'd inspect the firearms being brought in and if I found decent ones I'd buy them before they are turned in, at a higher price than they'd get at a buyback. Should be some real bargains there.

antzrus 4 months, 1 week ago

Why don't we ban water being used to fight forest fires? There is always water in evidence when fighting such fires and people and homes are still burned to the ground. For the same reason we don't ban Prozac (et al.), because water and Prozac are excellent methods used to fight the problems. They are not miracles just tools that sadly sometimes are just not up to the task.

Here in Wenatchee I've treated a few thousand folks during my well publicized career. And not one, nada, zero have killed themselves nor anyone else for that matter using Prozac or any other medication. Where are the Wenatchee mass murderers all zonked out on Prozac? None-Zero-Nada. Where are all my clients killing themselves, others? None-Zero-Nada.

Have I been accused of all manner of really dangerous stuff to humanity regarding my work here in Wenatchee? You betcha'!

Have I been convicted of any of it? No-None-Nada.

To answer the question of the thread; when I returned from the USMC after my 13 months in Vietnam I sold my Browning 9mm, Remington 6mm bush gun and my Winchester Model 70 300 Win Magnum (for elephants..?) to my old girlfriend's (she sent me a Dear John while in Vietnam) boyfriend for pennies on the dollar. I had had it with such weapons-and since I had not a lot of love for weapons anymore nor for the fellow, he could have the damn things.

antzrus 4 months, 1 week ago

questioning the link between SSRI class prescription drugs and unspeakable incidents of murder and/or suicide. We didn't have these drugs 50 years ago- nor did we have this class of crime."

50 years ago not every gun lover and his mama had civilian automatic rifles and 20-100 round magazines...

antzrus 4 months, 1 week ago

Is there a sane reason that military fully automatic weapons are banned? Could you imagine what a fully automatic M4 with an extra large magazine could do to a classroom, a school, a movie theatre?

If you can imagine that, then is it so hard to "imagine" what the civilian counterparts are doing now to us all?

Was it useful to ban military full automatics?

Then doing the same to the civilian counterparts might be...

Chuck 4 months, 1 week ago

50 years ago, the then state-of-the-art battle rifle, the M1 Garand, was a common and popular choice for hunting. Hundreds of thousands of these semi-automatic .30-.06's are enjoyed by sportsmen to this day. 40 years ago, AK-47s were making their way into this nation, as were AR-15's.

SSRI's ARE a factor, like it or not. Commonailty not necessarily being causality aside, there are just too many of these drugs in shooters' systems to ignore it. Whether this is due to their potential misuse remains to be seen.

But in every such shooting story where records are available, there they are. Certainly in vast enough quantities to warrant Congressional inquiries while they're on the topic of violence anyway.

Maybe you just took the time to follow up on your patients. I honestly wouldn't know.

I do know that writing it all off as "they were crazy anyway" and/or "think of how much worse we'd be without these drugs" is a classic cop-out in the absence of any full, thorough, and public inquiry.

maxpress 4 months, 1 week ago

Oh, Good grief. The assault rifle ban went into effect in 1986 banning full auto or burst capable rifles (selective fire) so as a matter of fact 'everyone and there momma' was capable of having full auto high capacity weapons and alot did. However that must not have been the driving factor. At one time the Thompson full auto .45acp with a 75round drum was common. Still no school shootings till the 90's. BAM, the left illeagalize everything to do with morals and values and dope the kids up to deal with not being centered and then wounder how one can kill the other with no emotion.

JimboBear 4 months, 1 week ago

And there you have it maxpress.

antzrus 4 months, 1 week ago

"Everyone and there mama" is your quote not mine. Mine is: "not every gun lover and his mama."

You know what I meant; military grade full auto (machine guns) have been baned. Such used in Newtown and/or Aurora would have been much worse-there is a damn good reason they are baned. The semi auto (civilian called "automatic") short-light with large mags are useless unless you want to kill other human beings.

Indeed, it seems the far right fringe have been arming themselves since even before 9/11, but it sure sped up the process. Angry, white, paranoid conspiracy folks have gone on a field day since then as you've noted-as they are even more now; the gun shops are being sold out.

I, Jimbo Bear and many others served our time in the US military just so our country would not end up like Afghanistan with every joe blow wandering the streets w/his AK and murdering groups of our neighbors weekly with no end in sight.

I joke about Prozac in our drinking water along with fluoride. Someday if this continues it might not be a joke.

maxpress 4 months, 1 week ago

The point being is since WWI we have had much more destructive firearms available to the public until 1986. We also had morals and values and the desire has not been there to use them. Strip the reason away for not killing eachother and it will not matter what you ban, people will kill eachother.

As far as anti depressents in the water, I hope that remains so. I get put on suicide watch about once a month. The overwhelming commonality is that they are non prior attempts that have recently been put on anti depressents. Excuse the grammer as I am typing from my phone.

Chuck 4 months, 1 week ago

If that day ever comes, I'll thank God more than ever that we have a well. This valley has had- and been the butt of- a lot of jokes on your account Doc, and I can roll with that as well as the next guy.

I just do not see the sense in solving the gun problem with (pharmaceutical) chemical warfare.

Incidentally, you're perhaps more likely to be shot in Chicago than Afghanistan:

http://www.inquisitr.com/257478/more-americans-killed-in-chicago-than-in-afghanistan/

kyook 4 months, 1 week ago

If I thought it would do a lick of good then...no. Knowing that it won't....hell no.

antzrus 4 months, 1 week ago

"SSRI's ARE a factor, like it or not. Commonailty not necessarily being causality aside, there are just too many of these drugs in shooters' systems to ignore it. Whether this is due to their potential misuse remains to be seen."

"But in every such shooting story where records are available, there they are. Certainly in vast enough quantities to warrant Congressional inquiries while they're on the topic of violence anyway."

In every shooter's body there is evidence of Idaho potatoes, Ding Dongs, McDonald's hamburger, green beans, Twinkies, milk, Wenatchee apples etc. etc. etc. Do we suspect these particular chemicals because of their close association with the killers? Do we suspect water causes forest fires? Gimme a break-even you can get that.

SSRI's are not found "in every such shooting story where records are available, there they are." No they are not; very few if you look.

If such were really the case Big Pharma would have lost multi-billions in suits, rather than racking in multi-billions because of their usefulness. If true, because of me and SSRI's, Wenatchee would have been a bloody wasteland. Not so, but I and a number of your local friends, neighbors and relatives actually helped educate the world early on in their understanding of what these meds can do combined with the appropriate psychotherapy.

Interestingly, too many folks have recently died from suicide here in town apparently. Yes I do follow up on my folks, and no/none/nada have been my folks on SSRI's. Those that died were probably too scared (already a symptom of depression) by such loud scatological nonsense to initiate treatment.

You spend too much time listening/reading the Church of Scientology (and others) scatological stories about me and/or medications. Rather, just "get clear" of your hobgoblins from outer space for what ails you, and your life savings as well as your friends and family who are not Scientologists.

Overt paranoia re so many aspects of life is rampant for too many in modern US society.

Prozac is good for that...

Chuck 4 months, 1 week ago

It's certainly put you on the map, and made you a nice living and I do respect that. I respect also that you quantified your position by adding "appropriate psychotherapy"- a point that may be lacking in the myriad of stories that do show a connection. But looking around the stats doesn't help any more than tacitly admitting that a multinational with lobbyists would have a better legal staff than some welfare case who was depressed (to a legal definition, at least) from the beginning.

And while medical records for living shooters are not (generally) unavailable due to statute, even a cursrory glance at records of the suicides/dead ones you'll find more Prozac in these people than Wenatchee Apples or McDonald's burgers.

Talking down to people who are suspect doesn't help any either. I'm no scientologist, rather a lapsed Catholic who was raised in a happy, rather "normal" environment by any account. It is not necessarily "paranoid" to question. In fact, some would consider that healthy. At the end of the day, there are some of us proud neo luddites who choose to be naive enough to think that nature got it right, and that shutting off receptors may not be any more wise in the long term than splicing salmon genes into corn crops. Half a century of either isn't much in the context of history. I never said don't get help if you don't need it. Prozac works for some, admittedly. Sitting on a rock at sunset enjoying a good cigar works for others.

Lastly, I never said that every suicide was related to SSRI's. But Columbine, Oregon, Sandy Hook, Aurora, and scores of others were. In my lifetime thus far, the only campus spree shooter I recall not involving SSRI's was Charles Whitman back in '66, and he had a brain tumor at the time.

And the point remains: SSRI's are all-too-common in spree killers. Period. I'm not asking for them to be banned, merely that they be included in any Federal inquiry/discussion on the violence problem.

http://www.ssristories.com/index.php

After all, if you're right and any perceived connection between SSRIs and shooting sprees is bogus, then those drugs could all withstand a little public, Congressional scrutiny in the context of the larger discussion.

antzrus 4 months, 1 week ago

"And the point remains: SSRI's are all-too-common in spree killers. Period. I'm not asking for them to be banned, merely that they be included in any Federal inquiry/discussion on the violence problem."

Water is all too common with forest fires where people are terribly burned to death. Come on, even your link at the bottom says: "We are not connected to Scientology." Yeah...

For a couple of years very wealthy attorneys working soley on commission worked the SSRI schtick to an extreme. Don't you remember? My gawd, Big Pharma was making multi-billions on the SSRI's in those days, and where there's lots of fresh rich meat, there's lots of flies (pardon-I have an attorney son). However, they didn't do at all well, because the well replicated (not Scientology-like) science of SSRI's held up in court countless times.

Now that most SSRI's are generic there really isn't much money made by the makers and hence no rich red meat for the flies. Hence we don't get much of the old spectacular news of SSRI's cases being filed any longer.

Speaking of official government investigations into the effects of SSRI's, are you telling me that Prozac specifically had not been the subject of such for over a decade? Come on fellow. Wasn't a warning issued early on that one might think of and/or additional suicidal issues on initiating the stuff, but not that suicide at al. might result?

But now after a decade with such a warning on each box there is a big movement in the scientific community to drop that erroneous warning; too many paranoid thinking people are running away with that warning, not initiating treatment and more are dying now by suicide than when there was no warning.

Incidentally, there are plenty of links about SSRI's as the cause of all human suffering. One of my favorites is by a woman named Anne Blake Tracy. She got a doctoral diploma from a now defunct diploma mill, is prolific and she makes great reading for similar "paranoid" thinking folks. http://www.happinessonline.org/BeTemperate/p10.htm

Interestingly, her site bears a very, very close resemblance to your noted site.

Oh, by the way my practice was (I'm almost retired-haven't accepted new patients in past 6 months and will retire in 2 months!) very lucrative.

Build a better mousetrap and they will come.

Chuck 4 months, 1 week ago

I'll stand by my point that SSRI's are common in spree after spree after spree. It's a link not to be any more ignored than the lawsuits successfully levied against many of these same drugs over birth defects.

Granted, some may very well with so see them in our drinking water, just as surely as there will always be others who cherish the ability to think freely for themselves.

I've posted a list of killings/suicides related to SSRI's broken down into two parts on another thread last week, in the "Opinion" section here, and will restate that if we are to have an honest national discussion on gun violence, these drugs deserve every bit as much a place at the table as semi-automatic firearms, video games, song lyrics, and motion pictures.

If you want the last word on this thread Dcc, by all means take it. With my blessings. I merely made my point in a public forum as intended, and have no particular attachment to the outcome of any given discussion.

However, with regard to your comments, it's worth closing my involvement with this thread with a quote from Maslow: "If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail."

Best of luck to you in your practice. If I ever need therapy, well, there's a psychologist in the family already--and he's assured me that I'm fine. :)

antzrus 4 months, 1 week ago

Thanx for chatting with me. Indeed, automatic weapons, mental health availability, meds (i.e. SSRI's), video games, modern song lyrics, Hollywood movies, alcohol (found in 40% of suicide victims), drugs and finally understanding better the dark side of humanity are only some of the myriad of issues that need addressing to better shape our evolution into the future.

Again to answer the original question of this thread and make the last comment (..! :-); I ain't got no damn guns to turn in!

davebugg 4 months, 1 week ago

If I had a chance to BUY a gun at a sell back program I would. After all, I just want to do my job of providing a good home for all the lonely and neglected guns everywhere. Please, folks, don't let these guns go unloved...adopt an unwanted gun, today.

antzrus 4 months, 1 week ago

I know what you mean. Just think of all those poor AK's being orphaned after a successful Predator kill in Afghanistan. And even more poor orphaned AK's in Iraq when a Sunni bomb explodes at a Shiite wedding or vice-versa...

Bring these orphans home!